The Great Dinosaur Mystery and the Bible Part 4
From EvoWiki
Taylor Taylor's Blame Game
On page 50, Paul gives beneficial natural wonders a bad name by telling about how sin affected the world stating that thorns and thistles, disease-producing germs, and fighting and killing were all the result of sin, which is false. Thorns, thistles, parasites, predators do have a beneficial purpose and are no way the result of sin. Thorns serve a purpose for plants by being defensive weapons against plant-eaters. In some cases, like in a desert, thorny spines of a cactus is used to preserve moisture and water that are highly essential for the cactus' survival. Parasites in some cases are highly beneficial and relied their hosts for survival. Even in environments that are otherwise too hostile for them to be in. Some examples includes a parasite that gets a spider to help a wasp raise its young and another parasite that gets a lobster to raise its offspring the same way it raises a new generation of lobsters. Predators are among the most beautiful (Being fast on their feet, sleek, and highly agile with their eyes faces forward in many cases to help zero in on its prey. In other cases, they are beings of great patience and wait for their unsuspecting prey to come by before they strike. Cunning. Clever. They in some cases will work together in packs to help take down their prey they are stalking for their next dinner.) and helpful of beings; able to keep animal populations in check and prevent overpopulations of plant-eaters over grazing the plant kingdom into extinction as well as clean up the earth of dead bodies to prevent diseases and stench from permeating about. It's all there to complete the ingredients for a highly, healthy ecosystem This YEC claim about the germs, weeds, death, predators, and diseases are all refuted in those pages down below.
http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CH/CH321.html
http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CH/CH320.html
http://www.godandscience.org/youngearth/genesis3.html
http://www.godandscience.org/youngearth/carnivores.html
http://www.godandscience.org/youngearth/death.html
http://www.godandscience.org/youngearth/paradise.html
Next, on page 51, Paul states that some animals became predators gradually after the Fall and the Flood. He claims that all animals were plant-eaters until after the Flood, when some animals becomes meat-eaters all because of man's sin, which sounds more like Paul playing the Blame Game like all other YECs and using man's sin as a scapegoat for all predation and carnivory. 2 web pages on the GDM site here and here and Page 51 in the GDM book tells of this falsehood. But as I discussed in part 1, If God wanted all to eat plants, then why did he create some of them to have razor sharp teeth, a stomach for red food, claws to tear at their prey, and strong muscular legs to chase after them? This is something YECs cannot honestly answer. Face it! If God wanted all animals to eat plants then He would've made them all to have cheeks to store up plant food in their mouths, molars to chew plants, strong, blunt teeth to pull up plants, and a huge gut with a complex digestive system to digest plants that are all made up of cellulose; tough fibers that made the plants very hard to digest and bacteria to help ferment them.
Taylor's Flood Folly
At the bottom on page 51, there is a bottom back and white image of the back cover of the book. It shows a Parasaurolophus on left hand corner of the image. On the upper right hand corner, there is a caption that shows what the dinosaur is and wrongfully claims that the stomach contents of pine cones, pine needles, fruits, and seeds found in many hadrosaur fossils were their last meal they ate just before or during the Flood. This is nonsense. How could Hadrosaurs eat as well as raise eggs and young, relieving themselves, migrating from place to place, and curled up sleeping, like Mei long was when it was smothered in an ash fall 130 million years ago, while they all are supposed to be running for their lives and head for the hills to vainly escape the flood? No doubt this claim made up by Paul is indeed flawed to the core.
A Waste Of Resources
Next, on page 52 as well as here and continues [1], Taylor states that God has given man permission to eat meat after the flood (giving into the assumption of Genesis 1:29-30 being nothing more than a commandment from God, while it's in fact not.); claiming that Noah and his family would have eaten dinosaurs if they tasted good, or so he thinks. He also states that the animals, even dinosaurs, must not kill man or else face the wrath of God for it. An imbecilic concept. How can dinosaurs not kill man and/or kill man while they've been really dead for 65 million years? How can Noah and his family taste dinosaurs other than birds, while in fact they never ever saw them alive? If animals like lions, tigers and Velociraptors have all that it takes to hunt and kill prey, yet they are told to eat only plants, then what good is it? They would all be totally worthless to have them. A big waste of features for them to receive the traits of a meat-eater, yet they're strictly ordered to eat only plants it will be.
What happens If There Was A Global Flood
If there was a global flood, all of the plants will never survive the flood at all. Plants that need little water, plants that need only fresh water, plants that are so delicate, plants that survive well in the desert, heck, plants of all types will all be wiped off the face of the earth (despite what Paul claims.) if there was such a case as a global flood and when all the animals leave the ark, they will all starve to death due to lack of plants to eat. Even if some animals become meat-eaters, they will all die by killing off all of the plant eaters and each other to vainly satisfy their hunger and die of starvation themselves. Fish will not survive the flood either. Freshwater fish need to live in fresh water and saltwater fish need to live in salt water. Put each fish group in the opposite water and they will all die. Put them all together in one setting and they will not survive at all. If there was a global flood, there won't be any freshwater fish, coral reefs, or even saltwater fish found alive at all. If there ever was a global flood, the world will be a desolate uninhabitable place. Even Noah and his family would have a very hard time trying to raise crops with all if all of the soil gets washed away in the flood so they will have to eat meat only because they will have no choice and watch all their livestock get wasted away due to lack of food and water and watch their own lives be wasted away and wind up dying of starvation themselves. By the time that happens, then the world will be a just dead lifeless planet just like all of the other planets out there in our solar system. Devastating! I'm glad I don't worship a mean cruel god who does wastes his features that way and put fossils in the earth to trick us and made the young universe and the earth to look old. Some creation “groaning up to this present time (Romans 8:19-22 )!” Thankfully, there is a much better interpretation of Romans 8:19-22 on this page from Rich Deem's site that you can see here.
Dinosaurs as "Fraidy Cats"
Next, on page 54 and on this page, Paul tries to answer the question "Where dinosaurs really as ferocious as they are shown in books and in films?" Some of them were! Especially Dromaeosaurs with terrifying sickle claws and menacing jaws and teeth. However, Paul makes this sickly claim to say that the dinosaurs were, in a way "fraidy cats." Let me explain. Paul states that because we have fossils it is difficult to know for sure how dinosaurs behaved. (If dinosaurs did lived with man, man would have kept an accurate record of them and their observations to give us a clear info on what they are really like. But this is never the case.) Then he goes on to say that most dinosaurs have small brains in comparisons to their immense size. He says that just because dinosaurs have small brains doesn't necessary mean that they were stupid as animals go, but they were surely [sic] no match for man's brain. Another far-fetched nonsense. How can they be no match for man's brain while they've been dead for 65 million years long before there were any people on earth and no one knows for sure how intelligent they really were?
Small Size Does Matter
Paul then explains about many dinosaurs that were quite small like Saltopus, a late Triassic dinosaur that is no bigger than a house cat. He claims that many of them, that were wiped out during the Flood, which there is no evidence for, were less than 15 inches long not including their tails. Paul claiming this as if to say they were all Compsognathids or Mussaurids, which is not so. Small dinosaurs in most or nearly all cases were actually much longer than that. Paul may think that most people pay attention only to the giants and it seems to be so, but people nowadays would also pay much attention to the small ones as well as to the giants. Who wouldn't want to pay attention to Dromaeosaurs, Troodontids, Hypsilophodontids, Heterodontosaurids, and Fabrosaurids, not to mentioned Compsognathids, Coelurids, and dinosaurs that are cloaked in feathers such as Sinornithosaurus for instance? Small size does matter along with large size.
Dinosaur Eggs
Paul then, on page 55a, talks about dinosaur eggs and even though most if not all dinosaurs laid eggs, dinosaurs may not at all laid big large eggs because the larger the eggs, the thicker the shell has to be. And if the eggs were so big and thick then the baby would not be able to get out at all. If the eggshell gets so thick then no oxygen will ever come in and the embryo would die and never hatch. Taylor claims that no eggs of Apatosaurus and Brachiosaurus have been found. But eggs of Titanosaurids have been found! They've been found in India and Argentina, Spain and France. The biggest dinosaur egg comes from Hypselosaurus, a Titanosaurid that laid eggs that are about one foot long by 10 inches wide. Despite Paul's claims, baby dinosaurs grow up real fast. Evidence states that on average baby dinosaurs like Diplodocus can grow up into adults in a matter of 10-15 years and lived to a ripe old age of 100. The idea of people, especially Methuselah, living long lives before the flood may have been based on a sexagesimal system of the base 60. Something the Sumerian people have invented thousands of years ago. The reference to this is here.
http://www.bibleandscience.com/bible/books/genesis/ancients.htm
Giant Animals Other Than Dinosaurs
Next, on page 55b, Paul states that there were other animals that became giants too. There were giant birds, beavers, bears, bison, kangaroos, and deer. All dated from the Cenozoic era up to and during the time of the Ice Age of course. There was also giant dragonflies too; dated back during the Paleozoic Era and the Triassic period as well. And plants were bigger as well like the tall giant horsetail plants from the Paleozoic and the Mesozoic Era and the Sequoia trees, giant trees that still exist today in the western part of the US. Not all of these Cenozoic giants existed at the same time as man. And no man ever saw giant horsetail plants either. But people never got bigger than only 6 to 7 feet on average. On rare instances, there were people that got as big as 9 to 12 feet tall but that's as far as man could get. Nothing more.
No Way Are This "Very Good"
Next, on page 56 and on this page, Paul states that the original dinosaurs were neither troublesome nor ferocious. He states that when God made everything he saw that they were "very good." Originally, in Taylor's imaginary world, the dinosaurs must all have been harmless, created to delight mankind and benefit the world, eating only plants and fruits. Pure Fantasy. HOW CAN THEY BE "VERY GOOD" WHEN THEY, IN SOME CASES, WERE GIVEN ALL OF THE ATTRIBUTES OF A MEAT-EATER, YET THEY ARE TO RENDERING THEM ALL USELESS AND DINE ON ONLY PLANT MATTER?! There's no way can dinosaurs be all harmless plant-eaters! Look at the Dromaeosaurs' sickle claws and the Tyrannosaurus' big powerful jaws and teeth! No way was these dinosaurs harmless plant-eaters! And no man has ever lived with dinosaurs and no one knows what color the dinosaurs were. So how can they be a delight to man and benefit the world when in fact the dinosaurs were all dead for 65 million years except birds? Birds are the one and only dinosaurs made and designed to delight man and benefit the world with their colorful plumages, their songs, their devouring of harmful insects and their playful antics in the sky.
The Imaginary Fear of Man
Now this is where the dinosaurs are supposedly to be rendered as "fraidy cats" after the flood. Paul uses his warped imagination based on what he thinks Genesis 9:2 mean and claims that after the flood, the animals and the dinosaurs were made to be afraid of people. The animals stayed as far away from people as they can because God wanted it to happen so that He can protect them from each other after the Flood. That's nonsense! How can THAT protect themselves while there's really no protection to it. He states that dinosaurs and man lived in separate areas of the world just like man and wild animals lived in separate worlds of today. Which to him probably explains why there are human and dinosaur remains not found together in the fossil record. It doesn't.
Does he know that not all animals are afraid of man including bears, sharks, snakes, rats, not to mentioned dogs, cats, spiders, and insects? Probably not. Even monkeys are not afraid of man either. Next Paul states that there were traces of bones, teeth, and stomach contents of many large dinosaurs allegedly killed during the Flood have been found assuming that most dinosaurs were harmless plant-eaters hundreds of years after the fall; not much different than an elephant and a giraffe in their ways according to Taylor's crackpot assumption. That's wrong too. No evidence of fossils being the result of Noah's flood and no evidence of dinosaurs being around during the time of early man either. Most dinosaurs were indeed harmless plant-eaters, eating only plants and fruit and some were ferocious meat-eaters killing and eating mainly other dinosaurs and the rest were omnivores eating all kinds of foods just like humans do; all are long dead except birds by the time man first appeared on earth around 4 million years ago.
Question About A Skeletal Image
On page 57 as well as on this page, You will see an image of what appears to be a skeleton of a T.rex wrongly arranged with a 4 fingered hand and a caption next to it that reads,
"Did the dinosaur uses its sharp claws of killing brachiosaurs? Or were the claws actually used to holding certain types of plants and fruits? No one knows for sure."
Answer: NEITHER! Neither did the dinosaur killed Brachiosaurs, nor did he ate plants and fruits. His arms only have 2 fingers, not 4 and could not have reached into his mouth. Brachiosaurs lived during the Jurassic period and were long extinct by the time T.rex evolved. T.rex is unquestionably a full fledge carnivore. But did he kill live prey or did just eat only bug-infested carcasses? Likely he did both.
Taylor's Imaginary "Veggiesaurs"
Next, Paul, on page 57 and 58 and on this pagethat shows an imaginary scenario of 2 Dilophosaurs wrongly shown eating berries and plants, makes a false and foolish claim that says meat-eating dinosaurs like T.rex could not be meat-eaters because they were clumsy movers compared to modern animals like lions and cheetahs who are slender sleek runners and their teeth would snapped off in battle. A blatant lie. One fossil of Albertosaurus has rows of teeth with no signs of wearing shown on them. True, but Paul claims that they were scavengers, eating carcasses that have already died if they were indeed meat-eaters, but thus far no stomach contents has ever been found inside of a T.rex fossil. Another blatant lie no doubt. Some dinosaurs like Dilophosaurus have delicate features like crests and spiny sails that could break if they fought and their sharp teeth could not have been used to just tear up meat but to cut up fruits and vegetables like the steak knives in the kitchen. All total nonsense.
Deinonychus and Velociraptor and others like them are known to be very slender and sleek runners chasing after prey with great speed and agility. Even T.rex is known to run fast but not as fast as the Dromaeosaurs and the Troodontids. Yet he's fast enough to catch a kill Hadrosaurs and Ceratopsians and other plant-eaters, who weren't at all speed demons either. The teeth of T.rex and Albertosaurus is very strong and long lasting and if a tooth breaks, it doesn't matter, for new ones can grow to take their place. T.rex could possibly be known as both a predator and a scavenger. There is a fossil Triceratops thighbone found with T.rex teeth marks shown on it as well as a Edmontosaurus skeleton found to have injuries inflicted by a T.Rex in the spine that have eventually healed afterwards.
There is a fossil of a T.rex with a chewed up hadrosaur inside of its stomach. (Varricchio, 2001) It is a fossil that belongs to a T.rex ancestor called Daspletosaurus. This is a dinosaur that lived 75 million years ago in the Cretaceous Period, 5 million years before T.rex evolved.
Dilophosaurus' crests are not used for fighting but to attract mates and intimidate rivals.
The spines of Spinosaurus is very thick and may have been used as a hump to store up fat like a camel or a sail to display or even to control body temperature. And speaking of camel, this link will take you to this site, where the real description of the camel's teeth clearly states that creationists don't know a doggone thing about animal dentistry and eating habits contributing to their dentistry.
Comparing dinosaur teeth with normal kitchen steak knives is entirely useless. T.rex and his kin has really thick, conical, strong, rigid, homodontical, long lasting, deep-rooted teeth that can easily cut through skin, flesh, and bones unlike those flimsy kitchen steak knives that are all thin and flat; they can bend, rust, break, go blunt when used a lot, and has to be sharpened on a wet stone from time to time. Dilophosaurus may have a weak jaw but his teeth are incredibly sharp and capable of slashing and biting through flesh and skin and the teeth of Spinosaurids like Baryonyx are all straight, not curved, unlike most meat-eating dinosaurs. Perfect for spearing and catching slippery fish they eat. Although the arms of T.rex are very small; about the same length of a man's arm, Abelisaurids have much smaller stumpy arms and hands yet that didn't stop them from using their jaws to kill prey. Like I said, T.rex never killed brachiosaurs nor did he saw them in real life. Brachiosaurs were long extinct when T.rex first evolved 67 million years ago. Brachiosaurs lived during the Jurassic period and became extinct during the early Cretaceous Period so T.rex never really saw the Brachiosaurs at all.
References,
Gut Contents From a Cretaceous Tyrannosaurid: Implications For Theropod Dinosaur Digestive Tracks
The Scientific American book of Dinosaurs
Edited by Gregory S. Paul
Copyright 2000 by Byron Preiss Visual Publications Inc.
Information from Chapter Five: Dinosaur Behavior.
"The Teeth of the Tyrannosaurus" By William L. Abler
Taylor's Lie About The Function Of The Horns of Ceratopsians
Next, on page 59a as well as on this page, Paul falsely states that God did not intend for the ceratopsians' horns to be used for fighting (what good is it then if that's the case?). Instead they were used to dig up, root, turn, and move plants around like pigs, which they can't because their horns are much too stuck up pointed high up to do that and some don't have horns at all. One exception could probably be Einiosaurus, a ceratopsian with a downward pointed nose horn. With that horn he could have dug up and uprooted plants for him to eat as he foraged around for food. Otherwise, if that's really the case, then what good is it for the horns are wasted on being used for just moving plants around? He really doesn't know everything about the horns of the ceratopsians and their functions, does he? What he assumes of what the horns do and what the horns really do is 2 different things.
First off, the horns were not used just for moving plants out of the way in a dense forest. They may have move plants out of the way in the dense Cretaceous forests of 70-65 million years ago; they also serve as excellent defensive weapons against their meat-eating enemies. Like rhinos, they charge head on defensively in an effort to scare away enemies and drive them off. However according to a BBC show The Truth About Killer Dinosaurs, a group of scientists tested out this theory and found that the horns can only be used to just to gore their enemies. Charging at them head on would result in their heads being shattered on impact.
Plus, the horns were also used to intimidate and wrestle with their rivals and show them off to impress females. In a rival match, the 2 males would lock horns and wrestle with each other until the loser weakens and breaks from the fight, backs off, and retreats. Extremely rarely do they fight to the death for usually they fight until one gives up and retreats. They were very social creatures that lived in herds and stick together for protection against meat-eaters like T.rex and Gorgosaurus. Even when they are alone, they can be very formidable opponents and can put up a really good fight. They may have strong jaws and replaceable teeth, but they also have parrot like beaks as well and chew up tough plants, twigs, roots (if the ground is soft enough), and small trees. Also, did you know that one particular ceratopsian chew up bones too? It is a total weird thought but ceratopsians may have been on rare occasions.... ahem, meat-eaters? Specifically omnivores?
There is one fossil of Psittacosaurus that was found to have traces of bone pieces inside of its stomach contents. Maybe the dinosaur swallow bones as well as pebbles to help grind his food as well as to get some protein inside his body once in a great while. An opportunistic scavenger? Unbelievable, but could be true, when more studies are made and more findings turned up. This is not exclusive for some modern herbivores like hippos also scavenge among the carcasses of dead animals on rare occasions as well. No ceratopsian ever had horns or spikes on their backs despite what Paul claims. Some do have spikes on their frills though; also to display for females and scare away enemies. Paul is probably getting them all mixed up with Stegosaurs. But one ceratopsian did have quill like spines on his tail and that's Psittacosaurus, the parrot dinosaur. Paul says that some beetles have horns like ceratopsians and just assumes that the horns were once thought by some to be used for stabbing other beetles but it is actually known to use to pry, lift, and carry things around. Likely he's talking about the rhinoceros beetle a.k.a. the elephant beetle; capable of lifting objects 850 times its own weight using its horns to do so. But also it is used to burrow underground to escape from its enemies and to engage in wrestling matches with a rival over a feeding ground and/or a female. But what does that have to do with the ceratopsians horns? Nothing! The Ceratopsian horns no doubt are not used for burrowing, carrying things, or just to move plants around. Besides the horns of the ceratopsians were in most cases were either pointed upwards or were to short to ever touch the ground and in some cases have no horns at all on their faces and frills just as mentioned before. Instead, they were used as mating displays and defensive weapons against their foes. What good is it then, if God did not intended on having the ceratopsian horns to fight back against their enemies when attacked and to impress their females and to ward off rivals? It will be a total waste of features if the horns are just use for measly moving plants around and not for defense. The references about the beetle and the ceratopsians is all here.
http://www.extremescience.com/StrongestCreature.htm
http://www.erin.utoronto.ca/~w3bio356/lectures/ceratopsia_and_ornithopoda.html
http://www.luisrey.ndtilda.co.uk/html/newchinese.htm
Taylor's Imagination About The Hunting And Killing Off Dinosaurs By Humans
Next on page 59b as well as on this page, Paul finally tries to answer the question "Did any dinosaurs ever become terrible and ferocious?" He claims it's a mystery and there's no proof that any of them where mean and dangerous, like they have been portrayed in books. He just assumes that it will take more discoveries before it is known how the dinosaurs behaved before the Flood and afterwards. It is likely man mostly killed them off for sport, pleasure, or food or so Taylor wrongfully asserts. None will be made. It's all coming from Taylor's head. All made it up while ignoring the fact that some of them were always terrifying and dangerous back then, even from the very beginning. Especially the Dromaeosaurs and the Tyrannosaurs, which are among of the most dangerous and deadliest of dinosaurs the world has ever known. Scientists were able to come up with possible behavior hypothesis in many dinosaurs based on clues found in the fossil record just as mentioned before in the first part of the essay. And finally, man has never hunted and killed off dinosaurs. In fact, except birds, Dinosaurs all died out 60 million years before there were any people on earth. So, there is NEVER any evidence at all for dinosaurs being killed off by man. No dinosaur skins for clothing, no dinosaur bones with spear heads embedded in them and/or injuries made by the spears, no dinosaur bones to make tools out of and no weapons being made for hunting them down, and no accounts of dinosaur hunting expeditions or dinosaurs being kept as pets, and no grave sites of dinosaurs and man buried together has ever been found in areas where remnants of cave, village, city and all other human dwellings of ancient times has ever been found. Not even a small trace.
The Real Certainty
Finally, despite what Paul says, Bible believing Christians, with real common sense in their heads, can be certain that they will NOT let their children and the adults themselves look at this Edenic Cult toiletry and others like them. They have no problems with evolution and God creating all things using evolution to modify it. I wish all Christians are like that. Then there will be no Edenic Cult, no ignorance, and the whole science world will all be much better off that way.
The Real Importaint Things to Remember
At last, on pages 60-61 as well as on this page, Paul starts preaching and denying that dinosaurs evolve from reptiles and amphibians; (Actually Dinosaurs evolve from Basal Archosaurs.) giving the gullible and the ignorant some “(sic) important things to remember”, which there is none. There is nothing important to remember when it comes to dinosaurs and you that has anything to do with morality, religion, and such.
Here's REAL important things that all must remember....
None of what Paul claims is true! Paul, like all YECs, has proved nothing of what he claims about dinosaurs. Despite his efforts to get preachy and give out the Salvation Message, YEC style (saying in other words, "Embrace YECism or rot in Hell."), any hapless soul who buy into this message will bring about their own downfall into atheism and/or other forms of religion that has nothing to do with Christianity, once they realized they've been lied to and none of what the YECs say is true and buys into the false dilemma YECs tout around that says, “If evolution is true, then the Bible is false. If the Bible is true, them evolution is false. You can only have one or the other, not both.” Thus, this kind of preaching is extremely dangerous to listen to and accept. To know more how YECism = Atheism, click here.
